Even though I'm not exactly prone to "fanism", I must admit to really liking both of these characters. This reminds me of a surprisingly well-written fanfiction named "Bodhisattva" I had read on shrinemaiden a while ago, where Byakuren was brought before Shikieiki for jugdement. Pretty heady stuff, and well worth a Google.
Robert3186 said: Indeed they're both preachy annoying moralizers.
Byakuren never really struck me as the "preachy" kind; she seems more like the "doing-what-she-believes-is-right-behind-the-scenes-one-life-at-a-time" type -sort of like a more flawed Mother Theresa - and she practically states outright that she's not really interested in changing minds. Plus, she's a bit too shady and too driven by her own conscience to fit the moralizer card.
The Yama, on the other hand...well, you're pretty much spot on :).
Patchman said: Byakuren never really struck me as the "preachy" kind; she seems more like the "doing-what-she-believes-is-right-behind-the-scenes-one-life-at-a-time" type -sort of like a more flawed Mother Theresa - and she practically states outright that she's not really interested in changing minds. Plus, she's a bit too shady and too driven by her own conscience to fit the moralizer card.
It's an opinion I suppose and given how thin many character's canon characterizations are it's of course open to considerable interpretation. She gave me a nagging mother/preacher vibe, and I don't think I'm alone in getting that, but others could disagree.
As for being too shady and driven by personal motives to be a moralizer... That's sort of exactly what a moralizer often is. The very definition of the word normally implies someone is unusually and perhaps annoyingly driven about the topic. It's not a word that's usually used in a nice or positive way by and large.
Now she's almost certainly not a nag on the level of the local Yama, but then her preachiness is so pronounced it's actually mentioned in canon...
@Robert: Well, a fair opinion, and one you're certainly entitled to. And you're right about how wire-thin most characterizations are in the world of Touhou.
I think it just comes down to connotations and definitions; "preachy" is someone who is forcefully didactic, and with the exception of possibly one bad ending, Byakuren isn't all that concerned about preaching, even allowing for ZUN's dearth of characterization. She's more willing to live and let live (albeit reluctantly) so long as you're not threatening her and her own.
Plus, words like preachy, annoying (though I guess she can be), and the like are often hard to quantify; for some, simply calling them out once on something they're doing wrong - even if it's in a non condescending way - are grounds for the accusation. By that account, many famous teachers in history - Socrates, MLK, etc. - fit the terms, which may, in fact, be true, but not many people invoke them negatively.
A "moralizer" is, simply, one who makes or expounds moral reflections - whether the negative connotations are there or not - but in either way, she doesn't fit the bill. She's shady in the sense that she operates more under-the-radar (though it can be argued in respect to her methods as well, which is a whole other story) and her ethics are more pragmatic; moved by conscience (NOT personal motive - there's a difference, though she did start off like that), she's a pretty bad Buddhist, and her actions stream less from a concrete base of moral belief and more from a "Gee, these youkai have been through so much - I should do something to help them" - far cry from moralizing.
I personally think the Yama would have some choice words with Byakuren, considering how most of her moral pronouncements essentially amount to "do your job", and Byakuren is a hypocrite in many ways, what with helping youkai when she said she'd exterminate them - definitely NOT doing her job.
Patchman said: I personally think the Yama would have some choice words with Byakuren, considering how most of her moral pronouncements essentially amount to "do your job", and Byakuren is a hypocrite in many ways, what with helping youkai when she said she'd exterminate them - definitely NOT doing her job.
Byakuren may have started out as a Youkai Exorcist Magician obsessed with eternal youth (sounds familiar? like a certain black-white witch?), but she has abandoned that job long ago when she had stopped using her brother's teachings as a cover and is now actually living her a righteous life as a messiah to the youkai. Her sealing in Makai was her punishment.
