Blackmail? Netorare?

Which one is it?

Billyaabob said:

Blackmail? Netorare?

Which one is it?

whatever it is i don't like it

kerosenedrinker said:

whatever it is i don't like it

Ye keep this type of stuff on r34

"Liking to someone other then her master."

Please do not use English if you can't speak it.

FRien said:
Please do not use English if you can't speak it.

And please do not be needlessly rude.
With the only real issues being the spacing in "takinga" and the wrong "then/than", that sentence is grammatically sound.

Billyaabob said:

Blackmail? Netorare?

Which one is it?

It's seems to me, it's more like blackmail then Netorare

Seems more like verbal abuse to me. I think the man here is commander, hence why they're in his room ("Shikikan's room") per post #4172772.

Poporopyon said:

Seems more like verbal abuse to me. I think the man here is commander, hence why they're in his room ("Shikikan's room") per post #4172772.

Fair, but it’s also possible they’re using Shikikan’s room just to emphasize the degree to which St. Louis is NTRing Shikikan.

The guy says “taking a liking to someone other than your master” after it seems St. Louis looked distracted, which might mean she used to like Shikikan (reminded of him by being in his room) but is now the man’s “property”.

I might be overthinking it though.

Billyaabob said:

Fair, but it’s also possible they’re using Shikikan’s room just to emphasize the degree to which St. Louis is NTRing Shikikan.

The guy says “taking a liking to someone other than your master” after it seems St. Louis looked distracted, which might mean she used to like Shikikan (reminded of him by being in his room) but is now the man’s “property”.

I might be overthinking it though.

If you read the earlier pages, she was caught speaking to a mechanic, who she seems quite friendly with. Commander threatened to have him discharged if he didn't screw off.

Along with calling himself her master and them being in the commander's room, having moved to this locatiom from the party they were attending, it's obvious this is the commander NTRing the mechanic.

blindVigil said:

If you read the earlier pages, she was caught speaking to a mechanic, who she seems quite friendly with. Commander threatened to have him discharged if he didn't screw off.

Along with calling himself her master and them being in the commander's room, having moved to this locatiom from the party they were attending, it's obvious this is the commander NTRing the mechanic.

Wow. So should I add this into Shitty Admiral? Or is that pool exclusive to Kancolle alone? This guy's a Shitkikunt. Feel free to remove it from the pool if so.

Is it really NTR tho?

The mechanic guy just said that she looked good.

Is any guy having a gf mean it’s NTR to all other guys? Maybe?

slave2thedrago said:

Is it really NTR tho?

The mechanic guy just said that she looked good.

Is any guy having a gf mean it’s NTR to all other guys? Maybe?

A form of cheating in which someone close to the protagonist is either willingly or unwillingly seduced and stolen away. This isn't necessarily limited to one's lover, but may also include friends, unrequited love interests, or even relatives.

NTR is intended to arouse feelings of jealousy, abandonment, hurt, and heartache, among other negative emotions. The narrative, dialogue, and such in these works often go the extra mile to incite and reinforce these emotions.

Despite it being called a type of cheating, it doesn't necessarily have to involve people who are actually in a romantic/sexual relationship. It's mostly about the feelings it invokes, and Louis and the mechanic seemed to be at least on friendly terms. Also the commander isn't talking like she's his girlfriend, he's talking like she's a slave.

Adding my 2 cents: this ain't netorare (the mechanic isn't being mentally tortured by seeing St. Louis having sex with another person) nor cheating (they don't seem to be in a relationship, they get along and maybe like each other) for me, just plain abuse (I don't know if there's a tag for this category).

I don't like these tags or categories, but there's a clear difference.

Pronak said:

Adding my 2 cents: this ain't netorare (the mechanic isn't being mentally tortured by seeing St. Louis having sex with another person) nor cheating (they don't seem to be in a relationship, they get along and maybe like each other) for me, just plain abuse (I don't know if there's a tag for this category).

I don't like these tags or categories, but there's a clear difference.

Except NTR is focused mostly on how the viewer feels, it isn't necessary for the character to even know it's happening. In fact, it being a secret is often part of it.

I agree that NTR is often focused on how the viewer feels, but anything that makes the viewer feel bad isn’t NTR

My thing is, this could probably be better described as just an abusive boyfriend or whatever since all the girls seem to serve the admiral. The mechanic guy is barely involved, it isn’t about her violating some relationship with mechanic guy, she isn’t cheating or being stolen or anything like that. Like if anything, the mechanic guy is the one NTRing here, I mean if anyone is.

I guess there are a lot of people that would be jealous of this guy banging her? But that applies to any relationship doesn’t it?

Is it automatically NTR is there is any exclusive relationship involving an unlikable guy?

slave2thedrago said:

My thing is, this could probably be better described as just an abusive boyfriend or whatever since all the girls seem to serve the admiral. The mechanic guy is barely involved, it isn’t about her violating some relationship with mechanic guy, she isn’t cheating or being stolen or anything like that. Like if anything, the mechanic guy is the one NTRing here, I mean if anyone is.

The mechanic can't NTR the commander because no one would feel bad for the commander. That would at most be cheating, and only if Louis willingly identified herself as the commander's girlfriend, and it doesn't look like she does.

The mechanic's presence is specifically what makes this NTR. If he wasn't there at all then it would just be a shitty commander being abusive. It's because the mechanic is there, and presented as a positive relationship for Louis before being driven away by the commander, that this can be called NTR. He exists as someone the viewer can identify as the "good guy" who gets bullied by the "bad guy". If the commander hadn't shown up it’s very possible they would have continued to enjoy each other's company based on their dialogue.

blindVigil said:

The mechanic can't NTR the commander because no one would feel bad for the commander. That would at most be cheating, and only if Louis willingly identified herself as the commander's girlfriend, and it doesn't look like she does.

The mechanic's presence is specifically what makes this NTR. If he wasn't there at all then it would just be a shitty commander being abusive. It's because the mechanic is there, and presented as a positive relationship for Louis before being driven away by the commander, that this can be called NTR. He exists as someone the viewer can identify as the "good guy" who gets bullied by the "bad guy". If the commander hadn't shown up it’s very possible they would have continued to enjoy each other's company based on their dialogue.

Eh I’m not sure about NTR requiring you to feel bad for the guy. I’ve seen a few that definitely take place from the perspective of an abusive boyfriend or some such, and you’re definitely supposed to sympathize with the guy stealing the girl as you watch it happen.

We start getting into people adding “”“official””” qualifications when one exist and speaking from an authority that they don’t have. When we go down that road.

It also looks like she accepts the situation. She isn’t fighting him or objecting in any way. when asked if she was the the admirals girl or whatever she would probably say yes even if shamefully. It isn’t really required for the girl to identify herself as anything in the first place.

But into the main subject I’m not sure having a positive relationship and enjoying each others company in such broad terms is enough here...that seems way too simplistic

That would apply to every single person she has an at least cordial acquaintance with. Like if there was a waiter at this party, is the waiter now being NTR’d? If a guy sold her that dress, is that guy NTR’d?

like at most, it can be said that mechanic guy wants to smash. But now damn near everyone who can at least hold a conversation with her, and wants to smash, is getting NTR’d because the relationship is “positive” and they’re a “good guy” compared to mean admiral over here.

Which is...probably most men that exist. And we’re back to. “Any relationship with a guy we done like is NTR?”

I think things are getting simultaneously too broad and too specific.

slave2thedrago said:

Eh I’m not sure about NTR requiring you to feel bad for the guy. I’ve seen a few that definitely take place from the perspective of an abusive boyfriend or some such, and you’re definitely supposed to sympathize with the guy stealing the girl as you watch it happen.

That's not Netorare. That's called Netori/Netoru.(Made a mistake, what you described isn't Netori, but it still isn't Netorare either, because the point is the negative emotions invoked.) It's a completely different concept. These terms have already been defined by other people. Yes, you do have to feel bad for the person being NTR'd, or it isn't NTR. That's what makes it NTR.

It also looks like she accepts the situation. She isn’t fighting him or objecting in any way. when asked if she was the the admirals girl or whatever she would probably say yes even if shamefully. It isn’t really required for the girl to identify herself as anything in the first place.

Of course she's not objecting, the commander's dialogue literally makes it clear she doesn't have a choice. You don't need to actively resist something to be unwilling. A lack of resistance is not a show of acceptance. It absolutely does require the girl to willing identify as something, that's literally how consent works. If she's shamefully saying yes, then she's not willing. Are you trying to say that if the commander says it, it doesn't matter what Louis says if she doesn't fight back against someone who clearly has power over her?

A form of cheating in which someone close to the protagonist is either willingly or unwillingly seduced and stolen away. This isn't necessarily limited to one's lover, but may also include friends, unrequited love interests, or even relatives.

This is the definition Danbooru uses, as well as the definition I and everyone I know uses. The mechanic is presented as probably being a friend, possibly even being a romantic interest. The commander appeared to put a stop to what was clearly an enjoyable exchange, and then expressed his control on someone suggested to not have any choice in the matter. That's NTR.

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blindVigil said:

That's not Netorare. That's called Netori/Netoru.(Made a mistake, what you described isn't Netori, but it still isn't Netorare either, because the point is the negative emotions invoked.) It's a completely different concept. These terms have already been defined by other people. Yes, you do have to feel bad for the person being NTR'd, or it isn't NTR. That's what makes it NTR.

Of course she's not objecting, the commander's dialogue literally makes it clear she doesn't have a choice. You don't need to actively resist something to be unwilling. A lack of resistance is not a show of acceptance. It absolutely does require the girl to willing identify as something, that's literally how consent works. If she's shamefully saying yes, then she's not willing. Are you trying to say that if the commander says it, it doesn't matter what Louis says if she doesn't fight back against someone who clearly has power over her?

This is the definition Danbooru uses, as well as the definition I and everyone I know uses. The mechanic is presented as probably being a friend, possibly even being a romantic interest. The commander appeared to put a stop to what was clearly an enjoyable exchange, and then expressed his control on someone suggested to not have any choice in the matter. That's NTR.

No. Netori is from the perspective of the person stealing regardless of how you feel. The majority of people use the term that way. Here we go with the “speaking From authority you don’t have” thing again. No that’s not “what makes it NTR”.

I wasn’t talking about consent I was talking about whether or not the relationship exists. Also typical NTR tropes usually means she enjoys the sex quite a lot and probably would go back to him. That’s how these things usually work.

And no, NTR doesn’t require the girl to identify as anything. See the case of a secret crush or whatever. The girl doesn’t have to identify herself as a secret crush. That would be silly. You’re making up rules that didn’t exist like I said.

Just because you use something and some hypoothetical “people you know” use something doesn’t make it right, and regardless you’re even going against the definition you’re using.

“Probably” a friend? “Maybe” a love interest”? “Enjoyable exchange”? These vague things that barely establish a relationship beyond aquaintance have to stretch to maybe for the definition.

We are back to “it’s NTR if she has an bad boyfriend and she ever has a casual conversation with anyone who thinks she’s attractive”

A definition has to define something. If it’s so broad that it can be applied to almost anything, it’s not a definition that serves its purpose. If it describes a bunch of things outside of its definition. It’s not a good definition.

You still haven’t even answered my question. If we’re using the “unlikable bf means NTR” then standard then fine. But I don’t even know if that’s what we’re doing.